Supernatural adoptions, and the depression that follows

I was reading in a blog the supernatural ways in which infertile women can have a baby, through adoption.... thanks and praise given to God, of course.

Oddly enough, with the super-natural help of God, (and adoption agencies and orphan-centers is places like Korea, where young single unmarried mothers have not been encouraged to keep their babies after birth....until recently) there also comes the super-natural mis-carriage of justice.

 In the past week we have talked, grieved and cried over the recent changes in Korea. In some ways the difficult news felt like a miscarriage, or the loss of a dream. However, God has been speaking to us over and over again about trusting His timing and His perfect plan. This week I have been reminded of our infertility journey and of the supernatural way in which God led us to adopt!

[From:   Tremendous Encouragement From Friends in a Time of Sorrow... , June 9, 2011 ]

Umm.... is Korea's changing rules to adoption to a foreign infertile adopter much like a pregnant woman's miscarriage?  Is that what these adopters are now claiming?  Because I gotta inform people -- the cramping, bleeding and the hormonal shifts that take place after a miscarriage is NOT the same as feeling depressed after one learns the adoption policy/process in a foreign country is about to change.  Really.

This leads me to my next question.  Are these emotional roller-coastering PAMoms likely to be candidates for post-partum Post Adoption Depression, too?  If so, can we weed these PAPs out of Adoptionland, ASAP -- for the sake and best interest of truly orphaned adoptable children?

Last, but certainly not least... what do others think about the begging for donations to help pay international adoption costs?  The blogger noted above claims she needs $35,000 to help make her adoption dreams a reality.  So far she received $6,000.  To justify the 'need' for so much money, she writes:

Unfortunately, we lost nearly $15,000 when our adoption in El Salvador failed. We are currently raising $35,000 to cover our Korean adoption costs. These costs include immigration fees, social worker visits, medical visits and evaluations, airline tickets and travel costs, Korean country fees and home study agency and adoption agency fees. Please pray for us as we apply for grants to help cover these required funds.

Do these PAPs think about the many single-mothers in Korea... the ones who could use that money, and care-services, instead?



I think it is incredibly sad that someone would "grieve" over women in Korea being encouraged to keep their babies. How can one respect the culture of a child if they do not respect individuals within that culture and their right to parent their own children? And if someone can't respect a child's culture, heritage, and country.....WHY in the world do they want to adopt?!

As an adult adoptee and someone who has had a miscarriage, I find it incredibly sad that anyone would make these comparisons.

Culture and identity

And if someone can't respect a child's culture, heritage, and country.....WHY in the world do they want to adopt?!

Oh, you silly goose you.... don't you know a foreigner's culture can be re-created in Heritage Camps, like those found through adoption agencies like Dillon International?  [Can we see and spell m-o-r-e profit/money for the adoption agency?]

It's GREAT to celebrate another culture, provided it's done in America.  That was dripping with sarcasm, btw...

Hey, if these people want to adopt foreign-born orphans "languishing in poor care"... let's have a resident requirement.  Let's have the PAPs move to the child's country, and let's let the adults adapt to the adoption-option.  Who knows, maybe such an adoption requirement may make local/domestic adoption plans not so undesirable.

Just really insulting

That statement is just really insulting to women who have had a miscarriage. As a woman who has miscarried several time, the physical pain, bleeding and the grief of losing one's child does NOT compare to Korea making a quota! No need to mention the hormonal roller-coaster and the healing that one's body has to incur after the miscarriage. The depression is real....because one's baby died! How stupid to even compare the two!!

More insults to the child's injury...

I liken such insults to adoption being a paper pregnancy and born from a woman's heart.

Both put more focus on the female enduring what she must do for a child she wants (for whatever reason) forgetting there is a living breathing human being put through an enormous amount of stress to make HER adoption dream (to be a mom?) possible.

...and isn't this off-focus issue the most of all insulting adoption issues in Adoptionland?  More pro-adoption advocates seem more focused on the "me" ("my strong feelings/beliefs") than what is actually happening to an unfortunate innocent child born into this nutty world.


when a person miscarries, they lose a part of themselves.

if a person experiences the loss of an adopted child, another child can and will easily replace the unknown.

there is no comparison.


i know

I know this is an old

I know this is an old comment, but I wonder why you think that adopted children are interchangeable? Surely it's as possible for an expectant mother to attach to the adoptive child she hasn't met as it is to the unborn child she hasn't met.

Raising money for the adoption

That is an interesting point. If they don't have the money for the adoption, how did they get approved?

Love, not money

Oh you silly silly pet.... do you not know your proper adoption-talk?  It takes LOVE, (not money), to raise a child, properly.

Welcome to my insanity.

Donations given to which charity?

Maybe it would be nice if the money raised by this family for the adoption of one child would instead be given to support services in Korea, so that pregnant women in Korea could keep their babies. That would really be a nice thing to do.

Keeping Christianity in an adoption-plan

 it would be nice if the money raised by this family for the adoption of one child would instead be given to support services in Korea, so that pregnant women in Korea could keep their babies

No "maybe" about that! ... from your mind and post to God's Plan... one has to wonder what these orphan-savers are thinking when asking for donations to help/assist  those in Adoptionland.

The arrogance of some people really amazes me -- what makes so many Christian Americans think every so-called orphan in the world wants to be an American? 

I recall many times during childhood my Afather would criticize foreigners who'd complained about life in America...(forgetting I was one of them ungrateful bastard immigrants...).  His comments always revolved around one of two themes :  "If not for us, (Americans), you'd still be under _______ rule" OR  "If you don't like it so much, why don't you go back?!?"

I would look at him, and think:  if I could (go back and start over), I would!

Some people just don't think before they speak.



Do they have a say?

Kerry- Do ICA kids even have a say in this? Does anyone ask them if they want to go to ...America?

 I think that many children in orphanages get visited by a gift giving PAP/AP and that is their interpretation of America. (if anyone thinks otherwise, please correct me on this).

Remember, many of these children aren't even orphans in the first place. As stated in the other threads about ICA first family searches: "Meeting the First Family: what are these AP's thinking?" they are discovering wonderful intact extended families, younger and older siblings and...a very present and alive biofather.


You ask an excellent question -- when can a child refuse consent to an adoption-plan?  I cannot think of many ICA situations where the child's honest opinion is respected or taken seriously by those busy working to appease foreign adopters with many wishes.

This is Adoptionland, a realm where children have no rights...(and ideally, no contrary opinion)... a fact that has HUGE implications both in and out of care.

Funding for ICA

Just today I read an article from the Sacramento Bee.  The following gives a good break-down how Americans can pay the required fees necessary to obtain a so-called orphan languishing in-care far far far away from state-side.

many people are finding that adoption outside of the United States is the right choice for their family. In addition to the actual fees, international travel expenses add significantly to the overall cost. This is something Andrea Poe, author of the popular Washington Times adoption column The Red Thread, knows about first hand. She and her husband Scott Jensen adopted their daughter Maxine from Vietnam in 2006. Her advice for soon-to-be adoptive parents trying to keep things affordable?

Funding: According to Poe, certain companies offer adoption assistance programs as part of their employee benefits package. For more information on this option, check with the human resources department where you work or the Dave Thomas Foundation's web site ( ) for a list of adoption-friendly employers. She also points to the military adoption subsidy as a benefit many active-duty service members are unaware of. The program offers up to $2,000 per child, with a $5,000 annual calendar cap for multiple adoptions.

Access: Poe advises balance with how much cash you take. Foreign currency conversion fees can be extra hefty in certain countries, and while cash machine withdrawal fees can be tedious as well, the cost is often less than you would pay otherwise. Credit card purchases can also get out of control when out-of-country transaction fees get factored in to the equation, so plan accordingly.

Taxes: Tax credits and deductions are another area of cost management many adoptive families fail to take advantage of, according to Poe.'s Dominique Molina agrees and states that for 2011, you can claim up $13,170 in credit for qualified adoption expenses, including reasonable and necessary fees, court costs, attorney fees and similar expenses. If the credit is more than the total of your final tax bill, you get a refund for the difference. For foreign adoption, Molina advises filing for the credit in the year the adoption actually becomes final.

[From:  The Frugal Traveler:  How to afford foreign adoption, June 20, 2011 ]

It's amazing to see how supportive parent-companies and government agencies are, (or can be), when consumers wish to make a big purchase, overseas. 

Maybe the problem with domestic adoption is simple:  it's not expensive enough for those wishing to make a really big deal out of their humanitarian spirit. Or maybe... there is more financial reward for chosen/"called" people if the Evangelican Adoption Crusade goes global, (and not just kept local).  Either way, something about funding ICA for eager to adopt people really stinks.... a matter that ought to be discussed more openly.

The Money Beg

I've been watching acquaintances go through an adoption in Africa, and I have to admit at first I was all "oh how fabulous!" But as time as passed and I read more and more, and seen more and more disturbing behavior, my views have changed quite a bit. In my "fabulous" stage of things with these people, I donated literally an entire minivan full of stuff to one of their garage sales to help them raise adoption money. There the stuff was, sitting here, I thought - why not? They're being so, so ... sacrificial; I'll help out since they obviously need it. And now as time has gone by (and the mom kept the bike I gave her for the sale to give to one of her 4 existing bio children - hmmm) and the husband has gotten a promotion that came with a company car (the promotion was "God's gift" because they are being "faithful" and adopting), and the mom has decided to sell all her living and dining room furniture and buy new because she "wants a new house without moving" - I'm reeling. And of course now the mom is desperate because of the delays that keep taking place in-country. Her baby won't be here by Christmas, she thought the baby would be here before this summer, why is this taking so long????? No thought at all that, maybe there isn't a newborn baby girl with no health problems waiting for her in an orphanage, and the increased scrutiny in-country is stopping her agency from going out and buying her one. No thought at all that "if I have to wait I will, because it is more likely that my child won't be trafficked." Just "woe is me, where is my baby girl? I decorated the nursery months ago and bought my 2 bio daughters black baby dolls already." Arrrrrgh! I wish I'd never heard of any of it at this point!

Thanks for listening to my rant. I know it isn't the first time you've heard it, nor will it be the last.

guaranteed delivery

Hi Tari,

Your story is indeed not the first time we've heard of this type of behaviour, but it is always good to hear it from different sources, so I am glad you posted this.

Unfortunately, despite the aura of saviorism surrounding adoption, the reality is often one of entitlement. Once money has been paid and papers have been signed, many prospective adopters feel entitled to receive a child.

In many ways adoption resembles the purchase of a good, and humans are conditioned that once you have paid for the goods, you are entitled to receive them.

Officially adoption is not an act of commerce, but it resembles one so much, that people behave like it is an act of commerce. This is also reflected in the fact that adoption, in reality, is about finding children for prospective families, even though the industry serving adopters, claim otherwise.

If adoption was really about finding families for children, there would be no waiting lists, where prospective adopters bump up one place on the list, once other prospective adopters have received their referral. If adoption was really about finding families for children, prospective adopters would be in a registry, only to be called upon when they seem the most suitale candidate to take care of a child in need.

Guaranteed delivery, albeit often with delays, only contributes to this feeling of entitlement and fuels a demand for children that eventually leads to the trafficking of children. 



Guaranteed delivery?

While I basically agree with all you stated, two things need to be made clear:

- Adoption agencies are the only service providers who are allowed to include numerous gag clauses in their contracts, e. g. : Fees do not entitle you to a guaranteed adoption  - they are charges for service.
Usually, there is this  feeling of entitlement and "where is my kid?!?" - attitude, so this clause doesn't seem to be of too much practical value and it never comes into effect as long as the supply meets the demand. In days like these, though, it might become an issue for PAPs.

- Adoption agencies can easily back out of their responsibilities, using another clause - that, if the relationship of mutual trust is affected by the (mis) behavior of PAPs, then the agency keeps the money and the contract is useless.

Just picture this: PAP calls agency, complains why he wasn't properly informed on charges against orphanage or orphanage closure. Service provider uses usual excuses ( wasn't me - was greedy big black man) - PAP doesn't buy excuse - and that is it. No trust, no kid, no money back ...


demanding the baby

Thanks Neils for your response. This same woman recently wrote a blog post on the difficulty of waiting, and your words about entitlement really hit it. She kept saying "this is not about me" but when you read all her other words, it really is. It's not about her in that she doesn't get to pick the child she wants (how could she?), but it is completely and totally about her in that she wants a baby, dang it, and she'll "rescue" one if it kills her. I don't think it has crossed her mind that it's possible there isn't a baby waiting for her that meets her criteria, absent someone else's chicanery to get one for her. She then said that she was willing to wait (like she has a choice) because she knows God will give her HER baby and not someone else's if she waits. She will receive (and she really said this) ISSAC and not ISHMAEL if she is faithful and waits. And then went on to remind people that it was Ishmael's descendants who blew up the WTC. So not waiting would mean she got a daughter who was a terrorist and didn't love Jesus? I know that's not exactly where she was going with that statement, but it's where she went, accidentally or not.

I do wish there was a way for it to be 100% backwards. When I think of friends who have done "waiting child" adoptions it gets closer to what it should be, I think, but the whole "healthy baby girl" thing makes me crazy.

Did someone say "God's Gift" to someone?

Ah, the ego... gotta love the ego involved in parenting AND adoption.

The irony is, in almost all cases, the new addition will not only NOT know what is new or old, but often times the AP's will over-stimulate the child with too many "things", putting that child in sensory-overload.  (Ever see a child in sensory-overload?  I dare you to watch a Gotcha Day video on an AP blog or You Tube... it's fascinating stuff.... especially if you're already a mom, and sensitive to the needs of a confused and overwhelmed child.)

But hey... at least this "must have new" motif follows typical new parent behavior.... we seasoned moms know who the new toys and gadgets and fan-fare are for, anyway. (Hint: it's not for the clueless kids.)

I myself feel aneurysms in me pulsating when I read about the (obscene) tax credits that are "due" to waiting/expectant AP's.  Worse yet are those televised house re-do's that get done for the sake of the poor over-crowded under-funded adopter.  Why all the generous over-the-top gift-giving from complete strangers makes me almost wanna adopt, just so I too can receive some of the extra perks and prizes that come with a mega adoption-plan. 

<laughing>...ok, that was a joke, really!

Sick thing is, there ARE some people who adopt, over and over and over again, just for the money, and the gifts that God the government sends.  [For some case examples, see:  Adoption Subsidies.]


I think I know that family

I think I know that family (or one very similiar). I have really struggled with not being supportive of this "friend." They live in a lovely home in the nicest neighborhood in town, drive nice cars, only shop at the most expensive stores for their their children...but were asking for financial support to adopt over seas! "God would not want us to go into to debt for this adoption." Where is the sacrifice? I have yet to see it. What pushed me over the edge was when she was selecting paper to send out her letters requesting financial help from friends and family. She decided to go with the handmade paper that wa really expencive. I told her that if she was really trying to get help from people she should probably just use her computer paper. she said she read that it really helps to use higher quality paper when sending out these letters.! REALLY?

What God wants

"God would not want us to go into to debt for this adoption."


I just looooooove it when "chosen people" tell others what God wants... especially when it relates to an adoption story.

If I were chosen to speak on God's behalf I would say God doesn't want children to be stolen or sold for personal profit, or abused by any parent figure.  However, I know better than think so highly of myself as to assume God chose me to act as his microphone.

The irony is, I was chosen for adoption...and the adoption was done through a Christian organization that associated itself with doctors, social workers, and a child placement agency that paid many of it's workers for their services.  As luck would have it, the chosen adoption ended quite badly. 

Much can be said about the person who assumes what God wants or doesn't want. 

Bottom line... the PAPs who claim God does not want debt to prevent people from becoming parents are not thinking about the message being sent.   If you ask me for my opinion, I'd say PAPs like this want a cheaper adoption.... and they're using God as an excuse to not pay the full price for an adoption.

Leaves a lot for interpretation, doesn't it?

There are a not

There are a not insignificant number of PAPs who not only know that the kid they hope to adopt is not available for adoption, but take it upon themselves to DO something about it:

1)  Reece's Rainbow PAP in Ukraine is attempting to adopt a 16 yr old Ukrainian adult (16 is the age of majority in Ukraine) that she wants to be adopted by Americans. 
 The PAP is  sooo convinced the girl would be better off in the US that they want to “know her fears so I [PAP] could help alleviate them and make her [girl to be adopted] feel safe” since it’ll obviously be “worth the struggle” to give up one’s country, culture, links to bio family and language to move to the US.
The PAP has also enlisted some already-adopted Ukrainian girls from her hometown to “write letters to our daughter [girl the PAP wants to adopt] to tell her about the things they [adopted kids already in the US]  have struggled with” and help entice this 16 year to allow herself to be adopted.
Coercive, inappropriate and suuuuch a bad idea!!

2) the consequences of convincing Ukrainian adults and near-adults to let themselves be adopted tend to be pretty awful: the Long family adopted 4 ukranian teens (after nudging them) only to disrupt 3 less than a year later. One disruption was after all of 35 (!!!!!) days. Really:

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