Kyrgyzstan launches 194 proceedings on illegal child adoption
Submitted by Kerry on Wed, 2009-11-18 12:23.
By Ivan Donis
November 18, 2009 / eng.24.kg
At least 194 criminal proceedings on illegal child adoption have been launched in Kyrgyzstan, Elmurza Satybaldiev, Prosecutor General of the republic told journalists on Wednesday.
As of today, over 30 cases were reportedly opened in the country. As to Satybaldiev, only seven persons figures in the proceedings, while the cases were opened against notary offices, wardship agencies and some officials.
Speaking about child trafficking, the prosecutor general outlined, that no cases have been initiated on the article in Kyrgyzstan as of today.
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What is interesting about Krygyzstan adoptions!
Krygyzstan is predominately a Moslem country, how is it that there was such a sharp increase in the last 20 months in their adoptions?
Remember Moslem law prohibits adoptions or exchange of children's heritage,religion, family to strangers. Moslems believe it is a relative, neighbor, community that must raise the child.
Must have been a lot of money thrown around the poor little country of Krygyzstan to allow such an increase and turn their head on the Moslem laws.
I will bet that 99% of these adoptions were by Christian Families--Imagine that?
For the 60 families that are on hold for 11 months waiting while Kyrgyzstan investigates the adoption system. They are collecting Christmas gifts for the children. I had to laugh to myself of their ignorance, they do NOT celebrate Christmas in Kyrgyzstan. It is Jallahabad they celebrate, not the birth of Christ.
About Kyrgyzstan
Population: 5,431,747 (July 2009 est.) World rank #113
Life Expectancy at Birth: 69.43 years. World rank #146
Ethnic groups: Kyrgyz 64.9%, Uzbek 13.8%, Russian 12.5%, Dungan 1.1%, Ukrainian 1%, Uygur 1%, other 5.7% (1999 census)
Religions: Muslim 75%, Russian Orthodox 20%, other 5%
Languages: Kyrgyz (official), Russian (official)
Literacy: 98.7% -- Male: 99.3%, Female: 98.1%
School life expectancy: 12 years
Kyrgyz adoption
There is nothing to laugh about the 60 or so families that are waiting to adopt kyrgyz children. The families that are waiting have had their hearts torn out of their chests for the past year. They think of their children every day, and they would do anything in their power to bring them to a loving home. There is absolutely no excuse for preventing the 60 pending adoptions from occuring. These are adoptions that have filled out the proper paper work, been approved, paid in full, and now are just waiting for the government to lift the ban. These children need loving homes, and the loving homes need these children.
Bottom line
"paid in full".... "waiting for the government to lift the ban."
Wow...
For many reasons those words imply an arrogance/sense of entitlement that upsets, disturbs, and worries me.
ditto
They think of their children every day, and they would do anything in their power to bring them to a loving home.
been approved, paid in full, and now are just waiting for the government to lift the ban.
It reminds me of what my adoptive mother told me often. She thought of me and waited for me, her daughter, everyday after the adoption agency sent her my photo...
As kid, I had no other choice than loving her as my mother.
Now, I wish she were alive for 5 minutes, so I could tell her that her money gave her the power to become my adoptive mother, but I was not her daughter; I was someone else's daughter. I wish I could tell her she was full of arrogance/sense of entitlement to began thinking of me as her daughter, whe she didn't exist me yet in my life.
ditto/arrogance
I think this is the most bitter and sad comment I have ever read or heard on the subject of being "somebody elses daughter", and I feel deeply sorry for all parties involved in this "family situation". I know so many PAP´s feel this way about photos of their (future) children, and I am sure many of them would be very surprised to learn that the situation can be looked at in a very different way, from the perspective of the "main person" in the process of building a new family.
becca
Bitter sadness
Before anyone judges the sad/bitter perspective an adoptee may have, (especially when that adoptee responds to a phrase that includes "paid in full"), please consider adoption as it is seen through the eyes of the child adopted by a closet pedophile.
Don't adoptees, like those mentioned within this group, have every reason to be repulsed, bitter, and sad because an AP claims all required payment was paid, and therefore a wanted/desired child is due?
For more than one minute, I wish more AP's and PAP's would see adoption as it is experienced by an unlucky adoptee -- I would like to think such a perspective could and would make things so bloody different!
Could not have said it better
I agree with the adoptees. Kerry you said it best. The paid in full had me running for the bathroom.
Bitter sadness
I did not mean to judge anyone, espeially not the person who shared her experience - I just ment to observe that I had never read a statement that was so entirely opposite to what I had seen and read before.
Before I offer my sincere apology, I would - if you don´t mind - like to ask for a clue what it was that made me sound like I was judging.
Thank you
Becca
Opposite experiences
From my own personal experience, it has always been assumed that those who adopt are above those who, for whatever reason, must relinquish their children to another. Comments like the following can be very triggering to those of us who have been adopted by people who should never have been approved to adopt, but got a child because they had money:
I will not post on Kimette's behalf, because I honestly believe if you knew her story, you would understand why being "somebody elses daughter" is a very tough pill to swallow. However, as an adoptee, ("another person's daughter"), who was ridiculed, abused, and shamed in oh-so-many ways in a so-called safe, loving, "chosen" adoptive home, I will admit, it's hard to feel sorry for any AP/PAP who thinks or feels adoption entitles them to certain rights and that God/life owes them something for their loss and pain. It's hard to feel sorry for self-serving people who think because they have money, they can get/do anything, and it's hard to feel sorry for adults who focus only on their own ego, their own, wants, their own needs, and their own comfort/pain, especially when a paid-for child's sense of safety and well-being is being ignored.
Contrary to many stories shared about the life of an adopted child, many of us were not the birthed by-products of drug-addicted whores or victims of neglect/abuse. Many of us were not abandoned, left to die on the streets or in the garbage; instead, many of us were taken by those who claimed to know what's best for us. Many of us were victims of horrible circumstances -- a mother died, a father lost a job or found a new lover and left his wife/children -- situations in which a single-parent needed help, but the only help that was given was through removal and poor replacement. Many of us were put in horrible living conditions, like over-crowded orphanages or negligent foster-homes because that's all that was available. Now, from a parent's perspective, imagine knowing hardship caused you to lose your child to a complete stranger. As if having a child taken away during a very difficult time isn't bad enough, imagine knowing your child was put in poor care and then sold to the highest bidder, because some people in this world like to think that is in a child's best interest. Imagine, too, that your loved child was sold to people who have all sorts of marital problems... problems that could, in theory, be solved, if only there was a much desired child to make an adult happy.
Contrary to popular opinion, there are far too many adoption agencies serving the wants and desires of adults... adults with money... and there are far too many adoption agencies not respecting the long-term wants and needs of parents and children.
The scary thing is, it's not just the little no-name adoption agencies taking advantage of financial circumstances. Big names, like Holt, are known in certain circles to be a placing agency that should be avoided like the plague.... but these are adoption issues not addressed or welcomed in many adoption-circles.
It's very difficult sharing a different adoption-opinion when so many want to believe adoption saves lives, and all AP's are great people. However, for many of us, adoption has been an odd sort of living death sentence... one that has destroyed light, faith, and innocence, and has made us loathe those who believe a child is owed, simply because a full payment was made.
Thank you
for taking the time for explaining.
I am very sorry for appearing disrespectful towards someone´s feeling and personal history,
And at the same time I would like to ask you to understand that I am trying to learn - at least -
so please accept my apology.
becca
<warm smile>
Anyone who tries to see life through the eyes of another lens/perspective deserves my respect and appreciation. [How can I not appreciate and respect another person's effort, especially if that person is trying to better understand things that don't make immediate sense?] Our goal at PPL is not to bad-mouth all adoptions/AP's.... our goal is to help educate people, so certain wrong-doings in Adoptionland can be recognized and addressed. Believe me, it's not easy sharing things that have been forced family-secrets, but if what we share opens further, deeper discussion, a greater purpose has been served.
Truthfully, I really appreciate it when others ask questions.... it shows me people want to learn and it shows me my simple core beliefs can be trusted. [There are those who do, very sincerely, care about the lives of others; those caring individuals do appreciate what we have to offer, knowing we don't want what happened to us, to go ignored and get repeated; and the very least good decent people can do is try to make life better for the next generation.]
All any of us can to is learn, try, and hope for the best.
adoption vs. abduction
I understand everything you are stating, but those families DO NOT own those kids because some adoption agency received some money and a few people in the country were on the take.
Adoption preys on your emotion, they hook you in with a photo, a sad story (usually not true) and you might even fly to the country and become even more emotionally involved with the child.
What has happened to people? Do you not want to know that the child you are bringing to America is in fact a bonafide orphan? Most orphans are really not true orphans as defined by the US State department, they lack the proper relinquishment papers and have living breathing family.
Just because some countries are able to contrive the proper paperwork doesn't make it right. These children are usually victims of hard economic times, they are in orphanages because their parents couldn't give them food, shelter, etc., they are LOVED. Just as the many American children that were abandoned last year in Nebraska because of hard economic times.
This is human trafficking and the child/baby has no say or rights becuase the Adoption agency and people in the country on the take are deciding their future. No one was laughing or poking fun at these families except for their sheer ignorance and arrogance that they believe those children are theirs like possessions or a doll purchased out of a catalog.
But the irony of trying to force Christianity on a country that is predominately Moslem is quite naive. Most of the Christmas toys they send will be re routed to a black market, trust me---I know how former soviet countries are.
Any time a country increases their adoptions as much as what has happened here there is definetely some adoptions that are not above the board. We found this out in Guatemala and Vietnam and other countriies where many families adoptions were halted or put on hold after a lengthy investigation which included DNA, etc.,
I noticed Irene Steffas is represenating these families, she will conduct a independent investigation. I know other people that have hired her. If she finds one ounce of foul play she will not help these families.
So lets see what happens after the investigations
Some of these families are declaring "medical needs"
http://www.eurasianet.org/departments/insight/articles/eav121409b.shtml
Same thing we saw when Guatemala closed down. Countless parents coming forward saying the child was "mildly retarded", "mildly this or that" most of it is untrue. The countries put these diagnosis down at the blessing of the adoption agency, as a plea for "medical necessity".
As a prospective adoptive
As a prospective adoptive mother waiting in hopes of raising one of these orphan children living in an institution in Kyrgyzstan, I am here to try and understand this perception of adoption. I feel I am taking great personal risk opening myself up to the raging hostility I have followed on this site. Please try to be open to my desire to understand, and my need to express my own perspective.
Clearly many of you have experienced horrible situations and I am sickened that any human being not have the opportunity to be loved and cherished by their family. But that is not the reality for too many people. This is exactly why I choose to adopt.
My intention in opening our lives to an adoption is so far removed from the concept of adoption that is communicated here. I am Christian; though not overtly, yet it is not my reasoning in bring an un-parented child into our family. I am the parent to two healthy, bright young teens. My husband and I are not "desperate" to grow our family. Do I have a yearning to hold and love and cherish a child that is not being given that gift? Yes. I just can not wrap my head around how this is a "bad" thing.
I have worked with children all of my adult life. I have donated time and energy to vulnerable families and children for years through the CASA project. I have witnessed the effects of neglect and abuse. I have seen the heart ache of some families that seem unable to pull together for the best interest of a child even given resources and support. I know the answers are not easy and none comes with out some human cost.
But please tell me how leaving these children to languish in institutions can be the right answer. I have been there. I have seen the hollow eyes of the teens the age of my 2 children at home. I have spoken with "angels" in Kyrgyzstan that have dedicated their lives to trying to keep the children that "age-out" at the ripe age of 14-16 off the street. The prospects for the future for any child left to grow up in an orphanage in a post soviet country is bleak to say the least.
As a prospective parent to a little girl living in this system, I have pleaded for UNICEF to track down her bio family and see if we were to sponsor her if they would bring her home. No answer. The independent people we have asked only said that she (the birth mother) was VERY young, working in the market since she was 9 or 10, and she does not want to parent this child. She wrote a letter after some prompting and I have yet to know what it says. I just hope the orphanage director will see it as this child's right to have that letter one day.
We have been told over and over that the corruption in Kyrgyzstan has to do with officials looking for ways to squeeze money as the paperwork moves down the pipe. They have been investigating since June 2008, and have not "returned" a single child from the orphanage into a home. One "waiting child” had a grandparent show up last year to claim him. He still lives in the orphanage and is of course not eligible to be adopted now. One child with a US family waiting family died of a respiratory infection at 10 moths old. One child is deaf and blind due to untreated Hydrocephalus. I have seen her photos over the past 18 months, it is devastating to witness.
The US consulate has been told that these children's paperwork has been vetted over and over again. It is clear that if they do not come to live in the families that have made a commitments to them from afar, they will live out their 14-16 years in these institutions. Anyone that is apposed to adoption should at least take a hard look at the alternative for these children. There is no one else coming to love these kids. A select few have family that may visit on occasion; these children make up 80% of those institutionalized in Kyrgyzstan. But many "social" orphans will never even meet their "family". There are only 39 orphanages in the country; it is not a case of being impossible to locate them. Unfortunately it is a socially acceptable alternative to raising “unwanted” children. But they are not being raised, they are being warehoused. I am not naive; I know there must be cases of coerced relinquishments. In 2006, a doctor in Kyrgyzstan was arrested for doing just that. But we can not think for one moment that there are not abandoned, unwanted children either. Just yesterday in southern California there was a newborn found in a trash bin. So what about the other 20% that are not claimed by families of are genuine orphans? What do you propose to do for them? With the low (almost non-existent) level historically of domestic adoption, Why not inter-country adoption?
The NGOs working in the arena of Human Rights are afraid to get too involved with this hot topic, but many have gladly taken our donations to help feed the children in all of the orphanages, not just the ones that have "waiting" children. We have sponsored surgeries of "social orphans” in hopes that once the medical needs were met the families might bring them home. Nope, not one. But at least they may stand a chance in life now.
What would you have us do? Turn away? Try to forget they exist? I can't. And not just her, all of them. They deserve better. The caregivers themselves say they deserve better than what they can offer. 2 caregivers with 28-32 infants! How could they ever feel loved or special, not to mention even getting their basic needs met.
I went into this believing we were following every law as it was stated in the books. It has NEVER been our intent to BUY a child. If it was possible to take in an unparented child with out the financial costs, to eliminate any opportunity for corruption, I am absolutely in favor of it!!! I am lobbying for that now. But my mind and heart is concerned with "the child in need right NOW, TODAY", not hypothetical abstracts. I can not help but keep going back to that child that I will be committed to forever, whether she ever comes to the US or lives out her childhood in that dark dingy place. I have met some amazing people in Kyrgyzstan that truly care about these children as individuals that have rights. I will work with them to try and have a positive effect on the lives of these kids regardless of the outcome of our attempt to adopt.
I hope that you will for just a moment step into my shoes and see through my eyes and heart. It is so hard for me to conceive that my intentions could be seen as bad or evil. I understand that there are horrid people in the world; I've had the misfortune to meet some. I am incredibly blessed to have not been raised by one; I can hardly imagine the horror. Many of the most disgusting excuses for humans I have encountered were biological parents to their victims. Had that newborn this week survived his mother’s attempt to kill him, should he have been raised in an institution, bounced around the system while trying to get the mother’s priorities straight, or been given the opportunity to be wanted and cherished?
With out attacking each other, is there no common ground between us and our perspectives?
PS.
Irene Steffas is not hired by us, but has volunteered her time to travel to Kyrgyzstan earlier this year to educate the officials in Kyrgyzstan. She is personally very supportive to us though, and we may hire her in the future.
And FYI Kyrgyzstan is not a devout Muslim country and as a whole seem very lax in their adherence to Muslim law and or not overtly religious in general. In fact the government has cracked down very hard on religious groups, especially Muslims.
They do celebrate Christmas and give gifts on New Years from a Santa character and his beautiful niece, the ice princess. Many orphans would never experience this Kyrgyz "cultural heritage" if it were not for donations from abroad.
individual versus systemic perspective
Thank you for your thoughtful comment, Lisa. In many ways I do understand your reasoning, though I also believe in the end it is not going to help children in Kyrgyzstan, or any other country to maintain the system of inter-country adoption.
From your response, I understand you look at the situation in Kyrgyzstan from the perspective of those individual children in orphanages now. When doing so, I understand your desire to do something to make their lives better, and I in fact applaud everyone for wanting to so. The question is what is the best thing to do. When strictly looking at the children living in orphanages now, I can even understand why you consider inter-country adoption a reasonable option.
When taking the entire child welfare system into consideration, things become very different. For each child adopted from an orphanage, another child will come to take its place. Orphanages receive donations for each child adopted and many receive funding for the number of children in care. So an orphanage has every financial incentive to use their facilities to maximum capacity. Removing one child from an orphanage through adoption is like using a bandaid over a gaping wound.
In the presence of inter-country adoption there usually are two means through which the population of children in orphanages is being maintained. 1) Vulnerable women learning about inter-country adoption will more likely relinquish a child, believing that way their child will have a better future. 2) Orphanages with a large throughput of children adopted abroad will find illegal means to procure children. Each foreign adoption will fuel these two tendencies to get children placed in orphanages.
Especially for infants this is devastating, because the negative developmental impact of institutionalization is the largest for this age group. Unfortunately infants are also the most desired of all children when it comes to adoption, so the pull towards orphanages in the presence of inter-country adoption is largest for infants and young children.
Infants are also most likely to be relinquished by vulnerable women, believing that way their child will have a better future. That better future starts with institutionalization for several months in order to be able to declare the child abandoned and adoptable. Those months of institutionalization and the resulting developmental delay would in several cases not have taken place without the presence of inter-country adoption.
Inter-country adoption is also unfair competition for domestic adoption. In many countries people can simply not pay the fees rich Westerners can pay, which keeps the figures of domestic adoption low. It is often said that people in sending countries do not want to adopt, but this is belied by the fact that all countries that closed their borders or reduced inter-country adoption significantly, showed an immediate increase in domestic adoption.
Inter-country adoption also slows down the development of domestic child welfare solutions. The best example of that can be seen in South Korea, which has been a sending country for almost 50 years now, and which, despite the fact that it is a rich country now, is still one of the major sending countries. The presence of a big and influential adoption industry in South Korea has prevented the country from finding local solutions. And it has prevented the country from facing the societal consequences of extra-marital pregnancies.
In other countries the creation of a proper foster care system was significantly delayed due to the presence of inter-country adoption. Countries have little incentive to set up a proper child welfare system when children in need are being adopted abroad, especially when that is accompanied by extra income.
I believe it is important to look at the entire child welfare system when dealing with the issues of children without parental care, not just at individual cases. For every child deserving a better future found in one particular orphanage in Kyrgyzstan, there are millions of children just as deserving, whom will never be adopted. The solution to these problems is not the removal of several thousand children each year, but proper local child welfare solutions. Inter-country adoption is not part of that solution, it is part of the problem.
Niels, Thank you for being
Niels,
Thank you for being gentle on me. I have to say I was fearful of the possible backlash.
I do hear you; I can grasp what you are saying. But I have two problems with those points looked at alone.
One, I can not, do not have the luxury of being able to look at the situation as a whole with out seeing the individual children. Their faces haunt me day and night. Seriously, I mean haunted.
Second, I have been feverishly studying the reports and statistic from Kyrgyzstan over the past decade of records for two years now. Abandonment was on the rise there long before inter-country adoptions were ever allowed starting in 2004. Soviet countries were shipping children off to institutions in growing numbers at a time when adoption was unheard of in their countries. It is a hideous social custom that must be stopped. There are over 20,000 children living in institutions in Central Asia (many are in boarding schools), 6000 are considered orphans, living in institutions in Kyrgyzstan. There are another 1200-1300 estimated children living on the streets mostly due to parental alcoholism or migrant workers. Right now the orphanages are over capacity, and the maternity hospitals have wards of infants sleeping 3-4 per cot. They have no where to move them to. And no child has left that country for international adoption in over 12 months. But they keep coming and in alarming rates. It is in the news regularly along with constant press trying to show the dark side of giving over children to be raised by the state. As you read the evolution in Kyrgyzstan, it just does not follow the "boom and bust" cycle that is seen in many countries. At the height of IA, there were 78 children adopted into the United States. I just can not see this as a “market” for children. This is less than .2%, point 2 percent, of the children classified as orphans. And there is no mistaking the medical needs of a high percentage of them either. You can not exaggerate cleft palates or missing digits or unused hands or legs. Clearly, these are not “undamaged” children at birth, and that is likely the reason for their abandonment. (A whole other child welfare issue that must be addressed)
Most of the pressure to de-institutionalize the children in the Kyrg child welfare system is coming from external (Western) sources, not from the Kyrgyz themselves. The average person you speak to on the streets in Kyrgyzstan (and believe me I did, in the Beta store, in the hotel, the drivers, shop owners) see institutionalization a valid option for unwanted children. It will take much time and effort to bring the changes so desperately needed. The concept of adoption seems very odd. I had the pleasure of meeting with a woman who is a member of the Kyrgyz Parlaiment this year. It was the greatest honor that after asking many many questions trying to understand why I would want to bring a disabled child into my otherwise healthy family, she said she could actually concieve of the notion of adopting herself one day.
I have meet two social workers that travel there every year to do trainings. This year is the first time that Kyrgyzstan offered any type of adoption training and support for potential local families to adopt domestically. I think this is a great development. But it is a hard fought battle to have gotten the program this far. And much of it has been financed by former adoptive parents that want to do something, anything possible for the children left behind.
And with the Kyrgyz government itself second only to Somalia in corruption (according to Forbes last year), it will be an uphill climb I am sure for years and years to come. In the meantime, I can not imagine even one of those precious children as mere "collateral damage" in a war against poverty, crime and corruption. Somehow the war must be fought on both fronts.
I do not think our concerns are exclusive of each other’s. We just have our focus on two equally tragic parts to this problem. I completely support the dire need to have systemic change in Child Welfare world wide. I am doing what I feel I can to turn that tide here in the US and in the Central Asian county I have grown to love. But still I also feel compelled to open my heart and home to a child that needs a family. I do not doubt for one moment that the child I am committed to in Kyrgyzstan needs just that, a chance at being loved.
Must be nice to live in a
Must be nice to live in a country where there are no children in need of a good safe foster home and decent surrogate family. Don't you get it? People who adopt foreign kids make it easier for governments to becomes even more corrupt than they already were. Need an example? Take a look at how the great United States is taking care of it's welfare children. Word has it now American foster kids are being shipped off to foreign countries because just like poor kids in run-down orphanages, they need a chance at being loved. Get it? American kids need to be adopted by foreigners because they can't be loved by their own people!!!
If you ask me, that's f*cked up.
My own personal opinion
I know many think I'm 100% anti-adoption. Just because I hated many personal experiences doesn't mean I can't see how for some, adoption can be a really good, positive thing. While it's true I was very lonely being the only adopted child in my class, in my neighborhood, in my chosen family... and it's true it was excruciatingly painful knowing the things I knew, (still knowing so much more information was being kept from me), what I really hated about being adopted was knowing I was purchased by people from another country. [Why wasn't I kept/wanted by my own people?]
Back in the 1960's Nova Scotia and Newfoundland, Canada were profit breeding grounds for those entering the adoption industry. From up there, came healthy white babies from socially unacceptable unwed mothers.
I hope a PAP considering international adoption can appreciate the meaning behind my words: While I don't hate adoption, per se, I do resent how adoption is used as the one and only alternative "given" to children put in a love-less institution. While my AP's were proud to adopt from Canada, (heroes saving a poor child from a wretched orphanage, and fulfilling the need to have another child to complete their family), I hated being adopted by people from another country. Back in the 1960's Canadians were selling babies to Americans because Americans had what Canadians wanted.... money.
It's almost 2010. When is that trend -- selling children to foreigners with money -- going to end?
Must be nice to live in a....
I am sure the Prospective Adoptive Parent post for Krygryzstan was very naive to a lot of things. Speaking for myself, when I adopted 2 children from the Ukraine, the agency swayed me away from domestic adoptions -
Ironically, today this same agency has ADDED domestic adoptions.
Today, I am mortified and embarassed that I live in a country that glorifies adoption of foreign children as the act of some glamourous movie star.
I and others had no idea how many Canadians and parents from the Netherlands adopted American Children out of our US Foster Care system.
It makes no sense to have US PAPS travel 5,000 miles to Africa (Ghana, Ethiopia ) or Haiti to adopt a poor African homeless child, whilest the US Foster Care system has thousands of beautiful African American children who sit waiting for their forever family. It makes no sense at all.
In the end it is PAP's decision to do what she wants with her own money.
I am starting to think the Surrogate International Adoption is the route I would take, seems more direct and honest.
Re: Must be nice
I don't see why race and nationality should play a part in this discussion.
IMHO it is very close minded to only have compassion for those who look like you or happen to be born in your hometown, stae or country. Why is an African or Central Asian child less worthy?
FYI I work with CASA and the Child Abuse Prevention council in my hometown. The children in Kyrgyzstan do not have any of those safety nets.
race and country, not an issue
That poster was pointing out how ironic it is that non-Americans choose to adopt American children. While many PAPs pay double the fees to adopt overseas. I didn't take it a poke at religion or race.
Nether do the non-americans that adopt so graciously from the USA our hard to place Africian-American or mix race children.
Some of the most ethnocentric people live in the USA, while Europeans are more open to adopting children of another race.
As an American I have heard many ignorant remarks from PAPs.
"I am adopting an Asian because they are close to Caucasian"
"We decided on an Ethopian adoption because the people don't have the Negroid features"
"We want a white baby and a healthy one, we would have to stand in a long long line in America for this.
Haha
"Race and country not an issue", she said, coming from the US where the history on race says something quite different...
"Race and country not an issue"...some of the most famous last words I've ever heard.
Safety net in Kygyzstan vs. USA
"FYI I work with CASA and the Child Abuse Prevention council in my hometown. The children in Kyrgyzstan do not have any of those safety nets."
Kyrgyzstan does have a safety net for CAP (Child Abuse Prevention), it is called "international adoption" and furthermore, not many people would think the comparison or the notion of "safety nets" here in America is hardly worth a dam. We still have many abused and dead children despite a psuedo safety net.
You should listen to your words, they are still justifcations for buying and selling of children in another country. You almost sound like the woman who cheats on her husband and justifies it by stating "I wasn't happy in my marriage"
Kyrgyzstan is thinking of starting a foster care system in it's country and there are protests from Americans (not Kyrgyzis) that this could possible cause child abuse as the people would not be educated or trained to be adequate foster parents. I guess the notion of many PAPs, looking down on the Kyrgyzis doesn't apply to all Americans but there are many who don't believe that a Kyrgyzstani child would not be raised by a fellow Kyrgyzi as well as an American can. (here is this arrogrance and sense of entitlement again)
But after all "Those parents have bought and paid for those children"
Like to see their adoption agency give them all a refund, that would NEVER happen.
Traveling to Kyrgyzstan, 2 whole times hardly gives anyone the expertise in the people, language, religion or their ancient history. While most of us would applaud your work with CASA and CAP, some might wonder why you don't foster an American child that has been abused or better yet......start such a noble program in Kyrgyzstan where they don't have such a safety net?
So who are these Americans
So who are these Americans that are against a foster care system in KG? Who are they and where are they voicing that opinion? I have not heard that anywhere and I spend upwards of 20 hours per week doing research and advocacy in this arena. I am curious as to where your information comes from? I would like to face them and ask them the hard questions as to what their agenda is.
I am certain that they are not APs or PAPs from the KG system. We are actually supporting both financially and through effort several programs that are trying to deinstitutionalize the children of Kyrgyzstan. (Through reunification, domestic adoption, IA, or foster care as well as societal and policy changes.)
At this time foster care is nearly non existent although the government of Japan donated 2 million dollars to the effort in 2000. Those few programs fizzled out and the children are back in orphanages.
humanitarian crises
Lisa, as of your point one, there is not much I can add to that. I do understand the individual faces haunt you, and there are potentially several million other faces that could haunt you, had you actually seen them.
I will address your second point in more detail. It certainly could be true that abandonment of children was on the rise in Kyrgyzstan well before inter-country adoption started. The question is, should we add to this cycle of abandonment by doing more inter-country adoption?
The problem of abandonment is not going to be solved with inter-country adoption. Most of the children living in the streets or living in boarding schools are children older than five, whom are not likely to be adopted. There is an inverse relationship between the number of abandoned children per age group and the number of children adopted per age group. Infants are less likely to be abandoned than older children, while infants are more in demand for adoption than older children.
Kyrgyzstan may not now look as if there is a "boom and bust cycle", but neither did that look so for Ethiopia in 2000. At the time "only" 95 children were adopted from that country, in FY 2009, that number has exploded to 2277.
In all sending countries it always starts with a humanitarian need. South Korean adoptions started in the aftermath of the Korean War, infants born to Korean women and American soldiers were said not to be accepted in Korean society. That humanitarian crisis led to the institution of an adoption system that soon started to provide all sorts of infants for the American adoption market.
Romanian adoptions, while already started on a small scale in the 1980's, really picked up after images of orphanages in that country were shown on TV, early 1990's. Again a humanitarian crisis triggered the rise of the inter-country adoption system in that country, and in the end few of the children living under deplorable conditions were being adopted, instead it led to large scale abandonment of healthy infants for the European and American adoption market.
Guatemalan adoptions, having a long history of corruption, also started with a humanitarian crises, a massive earthquake in 1976. Some of the children adopted at first were orphans, having lost both parents (even though that was never really established), soon after the out-flow of healthy infants started.
Each and every country involved in inter-country adoption starts with some humanitarian crisis, but ends up delivering infants for prospective adopters in rich countries. The type of humanitarian crisis may differ per country, but the growth of the industry follows the same pattern in each country.
I don't see Kyrgyzstan being any different, and with corruption being so systemic, chances are inter-country adoption will boom there if nothing is done to curb it. The figures may have been low, with 78 children adopted in 2008, but had there not been a stop that number would certainly have grown. In FY 2009 , 19 children from Kyrgyzstan made it to the US, while 65 adoptions were still on hold. Those two added is already more than the total number of adoptions in FY 2008. Given the fact that Kyrgyzstan closed its borders in October 2008, it's very likely that number could have been much higher for FY 2009, had the ban not been implemented.
No matter how well intended, and how deserving a child is of a better future, each inter-country adoption helps cement the adoption industry's standing in a country. Even the adoption of medically needy and older children, puts money into the inter-country adoption system, it helps create relationships between adoption providers and (possibly corrupt) judges, it helps the expansion of the supply chain of desirable children (not just the medically needy and older ones).
While a country like Kyrgyzstan certainly needs help building up a proper child welfare system, it is not helped by strengthening the inter-country adoption system.
Disturbing about Kyrgyzstan adoptions....
There are way too many infants that were adopted out in a very short, short length of time. This is how many agencies were marketing Kyrgyzstan - the wait time shorter for healthy infants.
Secondly, I find it very strange that many of these adoptive families had referrals of infants that were barely 1-2 months old. This is hardly enough time for the baby to be registered for the standard time of 1 year or enought time for the country to investigate abandoned or relinquished status. Did they investigate family members that could possible take in the babies? I smell PRE-SELL of babies! One family had on their blog they recived referral photos before they even had a 171-h approval-how can that be?
Lastly, it is suspect that way too many infants under the age of 6 months were coming out of Krygyzstan. The only conclusion is the Adoption Agencies were putting out the buying signals in Krygyzstan that newborns are worth money and the older true orphans that have the special needs of being over 5 years of age are bypassed and left to rot in the streets or orphanages the rest of their lives.
Dear Prospective Adoptive Parent
Please remember that is exactly what you are a Prospective Adoptive Parent. You and the rest of the 60+ families have been coerced by propaganda marketing of "institutionalization" this puts a fear factor in PAPs into adopting out of sympathy for the "poor little endangered orphans"
I too fell for this in the Ukraine, I adopted a sibling group only to find that the children were never in danger of institutionalization. The money myself and other parents spent in-country and on the adoption could have been the begining of starting a medical clinic or children's center for the children. Or a training center to assist the families with creating jobs or an industry.
Instead our money went (who knows where?)
Adoption is not the answer to institutionalization or the threat of it. Adoption and the money it generates in poor countries escalates the supply and demand of children to adopt. It becomes the countries leading export for money like Guatemala.
You speak from no information except what is being spoon fed to you by your agency who like so many others were flocking to Kyrgyzstan to make a fast buck: quick adoptions (get a newborn in under 12 months), guatemala is closed, new niche country where the laws have not caught up to the amount of adoptions and lastly where money is SO desperately needed. The children are USED as emotional pawns for PAPs as yourself.
I doubt if you know much about Kyrgyzstan and their religious beliefs, my family is Russian and the history of Kyrgyzstan is from the Mongolian Empire, currently many of the people speak Turkish and Russian. The younger educated ones speak English. Kyrgyzis are predominately Moslem, you need to do some research on this over 65% of the country is Moslem (Sunni) New Years (Nor Rouz) is more of a reason to celebrate than the birth of Christ (which the majority do not recognize) Russification happened 60 years ago when Russia moved in Russianites to the soviet satellite countries. They are a very small part of the Kyrgyzstan population, the Ubekis, the Kazakis, etc.,
The tone of your posting is still a sense of entitlement to these children. You have no sympathy for their birth parents or care that the majority of these children are loved. Every day, we think of my children's bio parents and their siblings. The poverty rate is over 50% some of these parents have no alternatives. So they do what so many Americans have done in hard times they entrust their government to the care of THEIR child.
I think it is great that Irene Steffas is working for free, her fees are usually steep because of her expenses of hiring attorneys and investigators in-country.
I personally don't think your intentions are evil but rather very misguided and emotionally charged.
As I try to put myself in your shoes, I hope that you walk a mile in the shoes of the parents of these children and how they are not less than you because they entrusted their government to watch over their children. Are you not aware of some birth families coming forward and claiming their children were adopted out of the country without their permission?
Because the social ministry of that country maybe broke doesn't give them the right to make decisions on other people's children or to make up for the loss in financial care for the children by starting a lucrative adoption business to recoup money - doesn't make adoption the right thing to do.
194 charges of fraud is steep. My guess? You will probably get the child/baby after the investigation and DNA are completed. After this? The laws will be more balanced for the people of Krygyzstan, it's children and citizens. MONEY will hopefully not replace the need for stronger local protocal.
Lastly, understand PAPs that the child you want to adopt has a family and more than likely siblings that have been so cruely separated. When I received my children's history, they were from a family of 6 siblings. One is in Spain, 2 are at home and 1 is with another American family who adopted the year before.
Understand that in order to make a family, another family has to be destroyed.
Just to clarify, I have
Just to clarify, I have hardly spoken to "my agency" in the past 16 months. I get all of my information directly from sources in Kyrgyzstan, Kyrgyz media, and the Dept of State as well as the Kyrgyz and American Embassies. I do not let anyone spoon feed me any information.
I have a very wide exposure to Kyrgyz and Central Asian culture, am a member of two Kyrgyz-American groups and communicate regularly with a research center here in the Bay area to better grasp the socio-cultural influences in Kyrgyzstan. I also have communication with nearly a dozen current and/or former ex-pats, many Peace Corps workers.
The child we are hoping to raise in our family is currently institutionalized, not maybe one day threatened with the possibility. That is the only "home" she has known.
The teen pregnancy rate is so huge in Kyrg (higher than any other CA country) that the majority of abandonments are in fact infants.
Since my degree is in Child Development, I am painfully aware of the facts and science behind what happens to a child as they "develop" in the absence of love and care. I have worked with many children over the years that suffer lifelong damage due to a lack of bonding. This is not "propaganda”; it is fact (read the Bucharest study). I will continue working with children devastated by such neglect, but when we set out to bring a child into our family, I wanted to adopt an infant that could be spared that horror. Why would it not make sense to prevent the atrocity by adopting before the worst damage is done? We try to cut out a cancer before it spreads, we watch for signs of illness to treat it before it overwhelms our system, why would I not want to adopt a needing child at an age that we could "prevent" so much of the damage that is done through institutionalization, isn't that a more humane and responsible act?
Also, one of the things that shocked me the most, the "street children" living in the shelters, most of them are preschool age to about 7 years old. Any older and they are more likely involved in child labor and not being brought to the shelter.
I do take issue with the assumption that I look down upon the young mother of this child, or any of the Kyrgyz families that have relinquished their children. Having worked with so many families that struggle over the years, I am keenly aware of how painful it is for all. I have no interest in stealing away or buying a child. My only interest is in providing a safe loving nurturing environment to a child that has lived with out that basic right for nearly 2 years. Will my husband and I gain from this experience, no duh, I love all of the children in my life and my life is far fuller because of what each one brings to our relationships. Do I feel like a "savior" or "saint"? No, not for adopting, and not for standing up for a child in court? I feel blessed to be a part of empowering a human to be who they are capable of being, I am only someone there to encourage them and help them knock over their own obstacles. That is my role as a parent to my young teens and the role I would take with this precious child as well.
Why is she not worthy of that to some of you? Because she was not born in America? Because her young mother had no one to encourage and stand next to her either? Because she hasn't spent enough months or years in that cold building yet, give her awhile and then when she is just in pitiful shape it will be okay to try and rehabilitate her spirit?
I am painfully aware that I am not her mother. Not by birth and not in any legal sense. But I dare say that there is no one working harder to be sure she gets enough calories, that her orphanage has coal for the furnace when the government turns off the steam heat each night, that a babushka comes once a week to exercise her limp legs and over tightened hands and arms. Her caregivers have never seen or heard from any of her family (who live in the same city), but they know me (this is not a judgment but a fact). And if I never bring her home, I will continue to be the one that watches over her, I promised her I would.
So please do not think for a moment that I am uneducated or have not taken the time to learn about the culture or that I am shallow enough to not realize that ANY adoption starts with a tragedy. I get it. I just do not want this child to continue to pay a price for circumstances that she has no power to control.
In February, when I am hoping to be standing before the Kyrgyz Kenesh (parliament), In addition to praising them for thouroughly investigating each and every adoption case, I will boldly propose that the Kyrgyz government set a tight standard for PAP and agency acceptance, insist on transparency and that they receive no money outside of paperwork processing fees being charged (this is how their domestic process is supposed to work). If they are brave enough to do this, they could be a guiding light in IA changes for other countries worldwide.
PS
Open any Kyrgyz website and you'll see Santa passing out gifts today. Muslim or not, Santa, "Christmas' trees and gift giving are a part of Kyrgyz culture this time of year. We just wanted the orphans to not be left out. There was over $10,000 raised to have gifts and parties (and full kitchens cupboards) for over 2000 orphans. And seriously, people are going to bash on us for this? WTH?
Just to Clarify or justify?
"I wanted to adopt an infant that could be spared that horror. Why would it not make sense to prevent the atrocity by adopting before the worst damage is done? We try to cut out a cancer before it spreads, we watch for signs of illness to treat it before it overwhelms our system, why would I not want to adopt a needing child at an age that we could "prevent" so much of the damage that is done through institutionalization, isn't that a more humane and responsible act?"
After adopting 2 older siblings from the Ukraine, and going through the attachment issues, learning English -trouble with social/school interactions, etc., I can now understand why the majority of you PAPs want "healthy infant babies" so you can mold them to your family.
You keep looking for sympathy with your rheotorical questions and honestly your justifications just sound like major excuses. Why would you try to get anyone on your side or to think like you? This is YOUR decision, if you are looking for sympathy regarding this 14 month hold on adoptions - I not sure many Americans would agree with you. One can only imagine the reason you have barely spoken with your adoption agency, but I am sure you have valid reasons.
I too live in california and happened to know we have a terrible situation with our foster care and many sibling groups are in need of a forever family. While your child development background is impressive, I am sure it could be put to good use in California. You keep justifying"Christmas in Krygyzstan as though the children understand what this is. Christmas is nothing to them except a chance to get a new toy or gift. You seem to THINK you KNOW MORE about the people of Krygyzstan than the CIA does, which describes the country as 75% Muslim. While you are looking at pictures of children in
Krygyzstan receiving gifts from a man dressed in a red suit that has no meaning to them. Open your eyes to the poor children in the USA those that are homeless, that didn't get a meal let alone a gift.
It is great that the children are getting a new toy for Nour rouz, but the notion that this is a celebration of Christ's birth is ludicrous. AND YES, whether they are muslim, christian, etc., make no difference in them receiving a new toy or gift. but you lying and calling it Christmas is a hoax and screams of something an Adoption Agency trying to push Christian Love on to a bunch of unsuspecting orphans would say.
I wish you luck in February as you stand in front of the Krygyzstan parliment and state your case before them. But please don't mention you will be converting a child from a Muslim to Christianity. You taking interest in the country and it's people is commendable. Although I am sure before you started the adoption process you knew very little about Krygyzstan and it's ancient history or where it was on the dam map! I have even more doubt that the Krygyzi officials would give a shit about how you THINK they should run their adoptions in country or out of country.
Hopefully when you get your child, that you bought and paid for -you help them learn and know of their rich and ancient history.
Why you are trying to justify or get anyone's blessing is beyond me. I have no sympathy for you other than I hope you can get your money back from the Adoption Agency.
Here is one example of what Christmas means to the people of Krygyzstan
But why would a country that is 75% Muslim launch itself into a version of Christmas fever? It’s very easy:
They are not crazies! This is very important to remember.
Tourism. With no natural resources save lots of gorgeous Colorado-esque wilderness, Kyrgyzstan could make a killing on eco- and adventure tourism.
Frying pan/fire, and prices paid
Being adopted IS the price for circumstances we have no power to control.
Being adopted is yet ONE MORE price/circumstance we have no power to control.
Kyrgyzstan Adoption alert 4/28/2010
Kyrgyzstan
Adoption Alert
U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE
Bureau of Consular Affairs
Office of Children’s Issues
__________________________________________________________________
April 28, 2010
Following the recent unrest in Kyrgyzstan, the Department of State (the Department) has expressed its support for the provisional government’s efforts to resolve peacefully Kyrgyzstan’s political problems and renew Kyrgyzstan’s path to democracy, economic prosperity, and respect for human rights. On April 20, the Department posted a Travel Warning for Kyrgyzstan. The Kyrgyz government stopped processing all intercountry adoptions in October 2008 due to reports of corruption and fraud in the adoption process. The Department is working to determine the provisional government’s stance on intercountry adoption, especially the pending cases of American families.
At present, the Kyrgyz government is not processing any adoption cases, including at least 65 adoptions by American families that were in progress when the halt was announced. Despite the unrest, we understand that the Kyrgyz criminal investigation of alleged corruption in the adoption process is ongoing. The allegations are serious: the Kyrgyz press has reported that two local adoption coordinators who worked with U.S. adoption agencies were arrested and released on bail. The Department urges the provisional government to complete urgently its criminal investigation and resolve the pending cases so that eligible children can be placed in permanent homes. We remind the Kyrgyz government that many of the children have serious health problems and that American families, despite the children’s medical conditions, distance, and a two-year wait to complete their cases, remain committed to these children.
The Department has repeated this message to Kyrgyz officials in Washington and through U.S. Embassy Bishkek. In addition, we have raised the visibility of this issue, and addressed questions and concerns expressed by Kyrgyz officials and shared by some Kyrgyz citizens, through outreach programs. The Department has sponsored the visit of a U.S. adoption expert to Kyrgyzstan and an adoption-themed study tour to the United States for three senior Kyrgyz officials. Finally, we have encouraged Kyrgyzstan to strengthen safeguards in the adoption process and eventually accede to the Hague Adoption Convention.
On March 19, the Kyrgyz Parliament passed a bill that would amend certain Family Code provisions on adoption. It was not signed by the president. If enacted, the government must still approve additional regulations in order for adoptions to resume. The draft regulations, which the Ministry of Labor, Employment, and Migration recently posted on its Web site, address the eligibility of children for domestic and intercountry adoption (including relinquishment and abandonment determinations); the eligibility of adoptive parents; and application, court, and post-adoption reporting requirements. Regardless, the possible effect of the new law and regulations is unclear: neither expressly addresses the pending cases. We are working to determine the provisional government’s position on the bill and draft regulations and how these measures would impact the pending adoptions.
The Department will continue to urge the Kyrgyz government to resolve the pending cases and act in the best interests of children involved in the intercountry adoption process.
You have no farther to look
Geez you Americans give such crazy reasons for justifying adoption in a foreign country.
First of all you have no further to look than your own communtity for children that are homeless. Currently in the USA 1.4 million of our homeless are children. www.homlesschildrenamerica.org
secondly, underage prostitution is rampant in the USA, go to any major metro area and their is child prostitution available boys and girls. Try helping out in your local community before you become involved in some foreign con game of adoption agencies putting a gult trip on you about children in other countries. Take a BIG LOOK at the children in the USA and the many tragic sad situations there are. http://childrenofthenight.org/ Human Trafficking in the USA is pathetic and sad. But what is worse is how Americans turn a blind eye to their needs and waste their time and money in a corrupt government.
There is nothing to laugh
There is nothing to laugh about the 60 or so families that are waiting to adopt kyrgyz children. The families that are waiting have had their hearts torn out of their chests for the past year."
Well when you play in the child trafficking game... and your a part of something that corrupt you should expect to get burned. Perhaps this could be a lessen learned that when you buy other peoples children your gonna get burned.
Selling children is supposed to be against the law. Period.
Somehow the rich turned child trafficking into this acceptable thing. Why? if you look all threw out history lawmakers (Upper-class) seem to think they are above the same laws that government rest of us. And constantly make exceptions when it's convent for them... such as the rich wanting to buy children. The poor don't buy children they can' afford to paying $10 000 - $80 000 for a child in "fees".
Again I will remind people.... here..
If party A pays money to party B and Party B gives party A a DVD player that was a purchase or a trade of tender for an object...
Now lets take the word DVD out and replace it with the word child.
If party A pays money to party B and Party B gives party A a child that was a purchase or a trade of tender for an child...
only the rich will try to convince you otherwise... just like back how the rich used to buy and sell black people. There is no difference except that now any race can fall victim to this.
If you ask me... they deserved to get burnt... stop trying to buy other peoples (More often then not) stolen children and you won't get burned..
It's like feeling sorry for a person who just bought some crack and got burned for the cash... like really what did you expect?
Just cause the upper-class say something is okay does not make it so. But I suppose if you want a child your willing to over look that it's child trafficking... why... because it's convenient and you get what you want.
Again the rich seem to do that alot.
Thanks to the rich you can buy anything you want... even a child..... I guess money can buy anything now....
So if your going to play the child purchasing game... don't expect people to feel sorry for them any more then a person being burned trying to buy drugs. Gee let me shed a tear for those poor people.. oh wait.. I don't have any left... I used them all up while I was being repeatedly raped waiting for a "loving family" to adopt me...
You want pity? No... not from those of us you are trafficking... get a reality check... no really... get one and come join the rest of us in the real world...
....
Man some of you just make me fucking sick to my stomach.... I could never buy a child.. But I guess I have ethics and morals... something people seem to forgot the meaning of some time ago.
If you buy a child you are no better then the person selling it. Pitty?
Really? Wow.... the kids are so lucky to have you all in their corner looking out for their "best interests" I can feel the safety and love in the air... ... or is that Bullshit, greed and dead children...
I always get those smells confused... you would think after a lifetime I would get it right by now.....
"These are adoptions that
"These are adoptions that have filled out the proper paper work, been approved, paid in full, and now are just waiting for the government to lift the ban."
Humm ya like Kerry said...
Paid in full? Anyone care to debate that this is not child trafficking...
PAID IN FULL!
"We paid in full. They are ours why do I have to wait?"
Doing tech support over the phone over the years you don't know how many conversations have started out that way. And it's a business selling people internet, phones...
Like the ABC commercial...said when I was growing up... "I can't see the difference can you?"
That statement proves 10 fold this is a child trafficking business. I could not have found a better more clear admittance of guilt. Paid for the children in full. Just waiting for the ban to be lifted... Truly the pro-side are some seriously disturbed individuals.
Can I steal your children and sell them while calling myself a hero?
Please?
I wanna be rich and feel important to...
Like really where do you people come up with this crap... like did someone knock you out the dummy tree and you hit every single branch on the way down and landed ass first on the dummy stump beside it?
Do you really believe what your telling others about the goodness of trafficking children?
I am sure you can ask a crack head about crack and they call tell you all the reason they think it's great... but you still wouldn't do it why? It's wrong...
Sorry I am lumping the child purchasing people with the crackheads... but if the shoe fits... I am gonna stuff it in your mouth... rest assured this adoption/trafficking non-sense does not have a leg to stand on... especially not with those of us you trafficked and almost killed in your greedy quest for children...
Your sickos.... not champions of children.... unless children love to be abused and passed around like unwanted dirty diapers... like you people even have award dinners... congratulating each other on how many children you sold.. stole and forced into a life I would not even wish on you pro-side people despite how much you deserve it....
Man I would love just 10 minutes in a room with you pro-side people so I can give you a taste of what the system is like to live in.... Though 10 minutes of sodimization with a broomstick really wouldn't accurately depict what it's like in care.... only about 10 minutes of being in care... Be thankful that will never happen to you.... you wouldn't last 2 minutes let alone 9 years of it...
adoption a business transaction
I agree for the most part with most of what you are all saying. But common sense, ethics and morals go out the window when these PAPs WANT a child. Many will turn their cheek to illegal and unethical behavior.
They only know what they have been told from the Adoption Agency, "the child is sick, the child will be homeless, the child will be insitutionalized, the child has a "special need", etc., etc., blah, blah, This on top of showing a warm fuzzy photo of an adorable child hooks many of us in. Some of these PAPs even have traveled to meet the child in Kryzgstan.
I know I believed everthing my agency told me in 2004, until I found out the ugly dark truth.
1)That the majority of the world's orphans have family and people who love them, they just don't have the money and means to care for them.
2) That relinquishment from a poor bio mom can be coerced, bought or stolen when money is at stake. Voila, any child can become "paperwork ready" in a poor country where bribes are rampant and people struggle economically.
3) Healthy babies can be manufactured, and pre selected then spend the required time in an orphanage before being adopted. Bypassing the central authoriity in that country. (pre sold). If that doesn't work, many agencies are offering International Surrogacy Adoption.
4) The many adoption agencies grossed over $1 million a year. That none of the fees are regulated, an agency basically can charge based on the economy and supply / demand. Hence, healthy babies (more so caucausian) bring in top dollar
5) International Adoption has for many years been unregulated and unwatched until, bio and adoptive families spoke up. There is more regulations on Plumbers, used car lots. For many years no re course, to be reimbursed for your money, no laws to protect the consumer. JCICS- there to protect the rights of their members/Adoption Agencies now may close their doors.
6) truth is coming out that the world's orphans are not really orphans at all. But part of the human trafficking and potential inventory depending on the country and how much it is under the microscope. One country gets put on hold Vietnam, Romania, Bulgaria, Guatemala or tighter restrictions. Another niche obscure poor country like Kazakhstan, Kryzgstan, Ethiopia, Ghana, Latvia open up----until they are put under the microscope.
If that doesn't work, create an adoption ministry through religion to "vow to care for the orphans and widows of the world" and then Special Needs becomes a HOT SELLER.
7) Lastly the agency will start offering domestic adoptions for the first time because they realize the gig is up on international adoption.
8) High profile, law suits against Adoption Agencies (FINALLY)
Enuf said, feel free to ad to the list. International Adoption is stepping into murky dark water.
9) In Alberta over 400+
9) In Alberta over 400+ ex-foster kids are in a class action lawsuit with the government. many of us are accusing the government of strong arming our parents kidnapping us and selling us to local pedophiles.
10)Natives in Winipeg are now launching their own lawsuits against the child protection industry... (Here the same people who run the foster care systems run the adoption systems... a total unethical conflict of interest)
11) In the works is a national lawsuit against the Canadian government. Since our government got in on the child trafficking market we plan to see people locked away. And 100% total reform of the CPS systems. In Canada these places are run with boards of directors etc.. I kid you not.
12) Everyone in Canada pretty much thinks CPS/CAS are lying con-artists it took over 6 years but now... good luck finding anyone who has something good to say about the system.
13) Everyday more and more foster care and adoption victims are coming forward with tales of horror that even rival my own.
14) the streets, jails, juvenile jails, homeless shelters, rehab centers, mental institutions are busting at the seems with CPS failures... but they use those failure to get more kids from.. it's like a self sustained child breeding pool... and government here totally set it all up. They have access to the same stats I do so they can't say they didn't know. Didn't anyone stop and ask themselves: Where the hell are all these homeless people coming from? And where these street kids are coming from in such vast numbers?
It's kinda scary....
Makes one wonder if our own government are willing to do these horrible things to innocent children..... if push came to shove what would they be willing to do to the rest of us?
Why do I get the feeling that Canada is more proactive?
thanks for your informative post about measures Canadians are taking to have a ethical and fair adoption reputation. An adoption that honors the birth family, respects the future of the child and treats people with dignity and respect.
It seems the USA is light years away.
In Canada the government
In Canada the government took our guns and any way for us to defend ourselves or stand up for our selves. The government only listens to the upper-middle class (Very small amount of people) and the upper-class.
The government has ignored well over 10 000 letters from various groups, agencies, individuals and so on. (Probably more but those are what I know of for sure have been sent. ) Asking to fix the system and help the children. The government doesn't care about anything but it's self. But sadly the government is comprised of people.
So that being said... this group of people who run our governments don't like the poor and view us as some kinda disease. And think by removing the poor's children and selling them to people they think are worthy they can eliminate poverty so writing them, talking to them showing them the dead children they are responsible for and the suffering of so many... and they don't even bat an eyelash.... they figure it's progress.
You don't even know.... how sick and twisted these people are. The best way to depict Canada
Swap that maple leaf for a swastika .and you have what Canada truly stands for... well at least our government/upper-class.
All we have are our our voices and the internet. If is was not for the public watching us sue the government here we would not have even got it into court.
The government and law society (regulates lawyers) has been constantly attacking our lawyer dragging him in to hearings trying to get him disbarred...
"
Fighting 4 Families is behind this initiative 100%.
We must support those who are supporting us.
VM said...
Done!
I, too, know Robert Lee and can attest that is a man of honor committed to people who are wronged.
Lee is opposed by Government only for his candid, frank portrayal of unlawful cases underscoring the wrongs by Ministry.
NO ONE else, but R. Lee will represent people who are wronged by Government entities... No one!
Please, do honour our children by supporting this gentleman in his pursuit of justice!"
Below is a link to their last attempt to have him disbarred. (Didn't work) But they will try it again and again... as long as Robert is trying to help us. That is the kinda people who run our systems. In their eyes we the poor deserve to have our children stripped from us and deserve to live in the streets and die. And for many of us that is exactly what is happening. And they will attack anyone who tries to help us.
http://www.lawsocietyalberta.com/lawyerregulation/notices/viewNotice/pop...
Like really read that... they are trying anything and everything they can. It's the most pathetic legal document I have ever read in my life time.
Canada is not what people think it is... it's a giant discriminating jail for the poor. Where even the crack dealers and murders and rapists, child molesters have more rights then we do.
All we can do is be active. But government is always taking out a group and we pop a new one up... so this will probably go on for about another 5 years before riots begin...
The poor here out number the upper-class/government about 5000 to 1. But the rich think they can do what ever they want because they are the law. But fail to realize.. people have a limit... most of us have already hit that limit of abuse and discrimination we are willing to endure from such savage cold hearted cretins.
And every time we protest or try they send police to beat us pepper spry us or use a water hose to try to make us stop.. most of the time it's kids protesting about poverty so the government wins every time.. as kids can fight police who are armed with guns pepper spray and tasers... but you gotta give the kids credit... they got heart for trying so many times despite what happens to them after.
Like the police that are sent by government to clean up the streets do anything I myself have witnessed police taking a man in a wheel chair begging for change, dumping him out of his wheel chair (He has polio Legs are as thin as toothpics) and call him a fake and take his money his wheelchairs padded seat laugh at him and drive off.
That is what Canadians are all about. There a few good people here... but it be like trying to plug a hole in hover dam with a pea.
Ask me if anyone people walking around him stopped to help the man?
No not even as he crawled across the ground to get back in his chair which no longer has a seat... no they did not they gave him dirty looks and a few even kinda snickered... It was a little old lady and myself who helped him back to and in his chair.
If we fail using their supposed democracy system they say exists here it's going to get very turbulent here.
Anyone know why?
Austrailia, Canada, Ireland, Spain have not had any Kyrgyzstan adoptions into their countries? Why is it only America that was fueling this adoption boom in Kyrgyzstan?
Israel, Germany, Sweden and
Israel, Germany, Sweden and South Africa all have done adoptions through Kyrgyzstan prior to the moritorium.
Israel, Germany, Sweden and South America
Have done under 40 adoptions from Krygyzstan in the last 10 years. Hardly a record like the Americans were going after.
America is the only nation on earth that pursues adoption in countries that are risky because we have a free enterprise and captialism is at work.
Now that American Adoption agencies are having their feet put to the fire with accountability this number is changing. That and the fact that many Americans in a recession don't have an extra $30,000 laying around. The old days of taking a loan out against your home isn't working in this economic environment.
anyone know why?
While Austrailia, Canada, Ireland and Spain are 4 countries behind the USA for number of import adoptions.
Because of past human trafficking issues and their agencies being actively shut down, these countries are reluctant to jump on a "new" hot country as the American Adoption agencies are. They are much more cautious with the adoption process. In the last year Canadians haven't even adopted from America's foster care system, it was the Netherlands that adopted about 70 US children.
To date, Canada has shut down their African adoptions because of their largest supplier (adoption agency) closing because of bankruptcy.
This week Austrailia has closed down their adoptions from Ethiopia and maybe all IAs.
Frankly, as an adoptee child- I am growing sick and tired of some of you PAPs that think you have the right to make decisions for other people's children. I wish I could sue the adoption agency and facilitator that took me from my home country, from my rights to know my culture and family into a family in America that paid (at the time) less than $7,000 for the pleasure of saying "this is our adopted daughter"
thanks
I know it..Thanks